Recruitment or advertisement/commercial posts: policy? category?


#1

I’m glad to see there is active recruitment for people with rust skills. More broadly, I’m not sure what the general policy or position on commercial postings is. It’s clearly good that rust is attracting this kind of attention, and this is clearly a place where an audience for such interests can be found. At the same time, they have the potential to overwhelm other content quickly.

In general, some level of such postings, clearly declared and responsibly conducted, could be acceptable. One way to clearly declare posts as such would be to have a category for them to go in.

Is it time to decide a policy on what that level is, and whether a category should be created for it? However, the policy comes first: if the acceptable level of such posts is very low, creating a category for them likely implies a higher level of acceptance and may encourage unwanted posts.

Apologies if the policy has already been declared and I have missed or forgotten it. I kind of think that “too much commercial attention” is a good problem to have, if that is indeed the case.


#2

Thank you for starting this topic, you beat me to it :heart:
I’m not aware of any published policy, so I agree that it warrants discussion.

I agree that it is good to have a place for Rust job advertisements, since commercial symbiosis is a great way to promote Rustanceans sustainably.
That said, I personally find it a little bit jarring (but manageable in the current volume) each time a “shouty” job advert pops up in the topic list. The (few) advertisements I’ve seen here are usually by newly created accounts, that have very little experience with the “culture” here (Or even Rust in general, such as asking for “3+ years of experience with Rust”, as we’ve seen earlier this year). I think our “club-house” should be open to this kind of thing, but the recruiters should at least wipe their feet on the doormat before they begin their pitch :slight_smile: Providing an explicit policy would be a great start!

I’ve brainstormed and researched a bit (i,e. ten minutes with a search engine, nothing spectacular), and here are some scenarios I came up with. I think it would be a good idea to make a Poll out of this in a later stage, but before doing that, I’d like to brainstorm more alternatives. (My previous polling experience taught me unwise to add poll-options afterwards, as it skews the results against the “newcomer option”, Discourse actively discourages this by making it hard/moderator-only)

suggestions for Job advertisement policies (please expand!)

  1. Running thread for all job postings (e.g. Jobs in Rust Development)
    • possibly as a “[sticky] post your jobs advertisements here”, if volume starts warranting it?
  2. each job posting gets its own topic, uncategorised and/or #help;
    examples:
  3. each job posting gets its own topic, in new “#jobs” category (category name to be bikeshedded)
  4. job postings forbidden on users.rust-lang.org, since enough other venues exist:
  5. “Seller’s market”: posting job adverts becomes forbidden, but programmers may advertise their availability.
    (personally not too fond, seems arbitrary to me, but it would prevent the “five-minute-old-account” type advertisements)
  6. suggestions welcome!

(edit: made snarky jab at earlier job postings less snarky :flushed:)


#3

I see how that comes off now, will update! The intention was to have a posting that had c++ or java background with ~2 years of rust work. Sorry to come in uninvited, and definitely not trying to spam. Happy to conform to any policy in place.


#4

Glad that you’re participating! Great to have some input from the recruitment side as well :heart:

My apologies for implying you were at fault, Your post clearly wrote that you were asking for 5 years general experience. I was referring back to another post we had ~a year ago (without naming anyone), who literally asked for “53 years+ rust experience”. (edit: sorry, it was 3 years, which should also lessen the confusion)

I see how my reference could be misconstrued as subtle criticism, and that wasn’t intended.

(edit, updated my previous post to make that clearer, and dropped the condescending smirk… :flushed:)

Since we have your attention, what would be the kind of guidance that you are looking for as a recruiter?


#5

Yikes. I hope you all were kind enough to inform them of their lack of preparation :wink:

I’m unclear on what you mean by guidance. Do you mean in our attempt to find talent, or to interact with the discussion board in a proper manner?


#6

Indeed, what could we do on this forum to make job advertisements more productive for everyone, i.e. easier for you as recruiter, and less jarring for us as forum-regulars.

I’m thinking that an explicit policy posting, that gives a few guidelines, a bit of background information, and probably some other venues to try (or to try instead, if we decide against job postings here), would be very helpful?
Before I can insist that recruiters should “wipe their feet on the doormat”, we should probably have a doormat/policy-topic in the first place :slight_smile:

I’m also wondering how we can make that policy findable to new users.
With the current low volume of job adverts, I think a Sticky topic at the top would be too much, but a “normal” topic might not have the discoverability needed to make new recruiter-accounts aware of it.
Is there any recruiter jargon/keywords that we should include in such a topic to make it easier to find?

Several people indeed explained it, and there was much bemusement :blush:


#7

I think the simplest solution, and one that a recruiter would pay the most attention to, would be a separate category. This would prevent unnecessary posts in the wrong place, and be easy to moderate. From my basic searching there were only a handful of posts/threads related to adverts, so I can’t imagine the volume or need for moderation would be too large. Just my input!

Ya’ll have a great community here. Thanks for allowing a civil conversation to pave way for potential new policy.


#8

Should also consider the “seeking new maintainer” / “seeking contributors”. To me would have such posts in the same category as recruitment.


#9

Hm. This categorisation would not have occurred to me. While it is, I suppose, technically recruitment, it’s about further community participation rather than a commercial advertisement, and I think that makes all the difference. Others apparently think differently, so some guidance and policy might well help.

Perhaps it’s just that the distinction I’m thinking of is more “announcement vs advertisement” than really about advertisements from recruiters specifically, and we should name potential new categories accordingly. I’d like announcements to be things that are genuinely relevant to the community at large, and not to (eventually / potentially) get lost among things that are merely broadcast.


#10

Would it be useful and/or productive if there a recruiter “ambassdor” … Someone already familiar with rust community that could co-ordinate posting job announcements? It might come off a bit beaurocratic or “gatekeeper”-ish but there some upsides that as well, e.g., cross posting to discord or irc, trusted source of info, knowledge of community practices and even specific people, …


#11

I think it’s probably one of these.

Categories have some useful characteristics:

  • users with some established trust level can recategorise posts, distributing the effort of any necessary moderation
  • users can mute posts by category according to their own interests

It’s not yet a problem, and this might be enough to ensure it doesn’t become one.


#12

I’m not sure yet if the current volume warrants an ambassador yet, I think a written document (which only costs effort/time once, rather than continuously) would suffice for the moment.
I’m also not sure if this kind of outreach is where I would want to “spend” my volunteers (they’re scarce enough already, and I’d rather see them do other Rusty things first)

Good point, that definitely speaks for a #category!